Luke
19-06-2009, 01:13 PM
I thought this thread might help some of the people here on SAR as they seemed enthusiastic about keeping their paint perfect. I brought this info from another site. It was written by Joe, who is a professional detailer.
About Joe
He works for the Adelaide car grooming company Glowridaz. They are based in Lonsdale, and you can view the site at www.glowridaz.com.au
Be especially sure to check out the work shops he runs if you are really keen to learn something (http://www.glowridaz.com.au/training.html).
Some people on SAR have used his services and have learnt heaps!!
Onto the guide:
Paint Work
- Modern day car paints today use a Clear coat finishes (also referred to as two-stage paint systems) are simply a layer of clear resin applied over the top of colored resin. Although a clear coat does protect the base coat, just like a single-stage finish, the clear coat needs to be regularly maintained to keep it in top shape.
- Paint needs to flex because if it didnt when you go for a drive or if someone put pressure on a panel, the paint would crack and fall off.
- Because paint needs to flex it is therefore very delicate and its abrasion resistance is very low and a rub or touch with the slightest amount of dirt or dust & pressure will cause a scratch.
Scratches
- There are different levels of scratches that can occur on your paint work, chrome, plastics, metal, mouldings etc.
- There are swirl marks or spider webbing which come from general cleaning of the car where by people in general apply too much pressure with a sponge or high pressure hose and they are created.
- There are 1500, 1200, 600 grit scratches which are deeper and they come from a number of scenarios. Most common one that I see is people get a bird dropping on their car which they leave. The sun and the acids/chemicals in the bird dropping edge into the paint work and leave a lovely mark which appears to be on the surface. People then go "Oh buggar" and try to scrub away this mark, at this stage they are applying huge amounts of pressure with a sponge or whatever scrubbing tool they can find and then realise after their attempt, the mark appears to be gone but the edging has been replaced with a number of scratches back and forth over the area that they tried to remove. Please dont do this.
- Bird, water spot edging into paint work that is unprotected most of the time cannot be removed unless some of or at times all the clear coat is removed from. The reason for this is that the acid from these contaminants with the aid of the sun has gone right through the clear coat and into the base coat.
Water
- it is not a lubricant, therefore it doesn't break up dirt, dust, or contaminants on your car.
- it contains minerals/chemicals which allow us to drink it without getting sick from germs
- when water mixes with oxygen (thus is left to dry) in crevasses, cracks, wiring or other components of the car it starts to rust or break down plastics.
- water from a car wash (which use recycle water) use even stronger chemicals to break down containments/oils/chemicals found in recycled water.
- non pure water i.e. that from the tap or from rain, that is left on the car to dry in the hot sun will cause water spot edging and stains. If the surface is not protected then some of the clear coat needs to be removed in order to remove the stain.
- distilled water (99% pure water) can be left on your car to dry without causing any damage to the paint work as it doesn’t contain any chemicals its purely H20.
Car Wash process with water, sponge, car wash detergent
- I find this topic pretty amusing because I find the process of cleaning a car with a sponge/wash mitt to be counter intuitive. The process requires you to use pressure to apply the sponge to the car’s panel to the rid the car of any further contaminants or dirt; however it’s that very pressure mixed with a slightly dirty surface which causes the damage to the car.
- In saying this you can of course clean a car with a sponge and car wash detergent without creating any damage but it requires the following conditions:
- The car needs to be washed under cover, in the shade and out of the sun.
- Firstly pre soaking the car’s surface with car wash detergent on low pressure & letting that sit on for a few minutes.
- Secondly rinsing this off with a higher pressure gun and not aiming the hose directly into the panel and standing at least a few metres away from the panel.
- Thirdly 2 buckets of water are required, one with the car wash mix and the other of clean water.
- The sponge/wash mitt used needs to be extremely clean and soft so that any pressure onto the car won’t create any damage.
- Sponge the car down, working top to bottom and after every panel rinse the sponge/wash mitt into the clean bucket of water first before re-sudding the sponge/wash mitt into the second bucket.
- After sponging the car down, rinse the remaining suds off with a pressure gun, if possible distilled water is the best to be used.
- Use a chamois or waffle weave drying towel to remove the excess water from the surface.
- If possible go for a short drive so the excess water in cracks and crevasses can drip out.
- Dry up any excess water from the drive.
Correctly washing the car with sponge and wash detergent is not a quick and easy process it takes time and concentration on the areas that you are cleaning to ensure no damage is caused. However if done correctly almost no scratching should occur. Now it might seem I am against cleaining a car with a sponge and car wash detergent process, well the truth is Im not, I actually believe its just about the best way to clean your car. However the part gets me fired up is that when the above steps and care arent taken place and the scratches are created and then owner of the car brings it in to get repaired and wonder why it costs as much as it does.
- So if the surface is dirty and you use a sponge, water and detergent doesn’t lift the dirt off the surface; instead dirt particles are grounded into the paint. That is why over time, you see on the paint work of your car, marks (scratches) in a swirl motion.
- Commercial carwash brushes can be even more abrasive. The reason they are is that over time the fibres of the brush deteriorate in quality and gather tiny rocks or particles which further scratch your paint!
- I have a friend who scratched his car at the local car wash with a car brush, so he went to the owner of the place and said are you going to reimburse me, and they said no. Because if they reimbursed him, they would have to reimburse everyone that would complain.
- the best way to get the majority of dirt and grime off you car is by using a low pressure hose with pure water either distilled or demineralised. Too much pressure will force dirt into the paint work, which is the same as using your hand pushing on the panel.
Understanding Waterless car washes and polishes/waxes
- there are over 20+ brands of these types of products on the market that I am aware of and that I have tried and they are all variations on the same theme.
- there are 2 main categories as to which these products try to achieve a clean shiny finish.
- Polyglaze, Turtle Wax, are the cheaper products on the market. They contain strong chemicals in particular solvent based silicones which are a big no no, that help break up dust/dirt and give a shiny finish, but in essence they are cheap product that meets the requirements of the shops shelves, i.e. price. No true car enthusiast will use products like this.
- there are more expensive ones out there i.e. Dri Wash N Guard, AutoShine, NoWet etc etc which contain good lubricants mixed with some abrasives i.e. pumas, which in essence remove dirt/dust/containments and some petroleum or alcohol mixed with caranuaba wax or polish & some filling agents which will fill in any marks/scratches created and provide a shiny finish. Unfortunately the abrasive component of these product, removes a little bit of your clear coat every time.... mmmm not very good at all. Its like using a very light cutting polish every time to clean your car. Any product that can remove oxidisation is not a car wash product but a polishing product with cutting ability.
- The Meguiars Waterless Process stands out from these products by using a 2 step process which I personally think is much better. Firstly they advise its not for real dirty cars which is fantastic and truthful, not like its competitors. The first step in the Meguiars process is to clear as much dust off the surface with a quality duster containing paraffin oil, which works pretty good I must say. Then its finished with their Waterless Wash and applied with a Microfibre towel. The Waterless wash is essentially a propylene glycol mix with mostly water which will give a shiny finish, it doesn’t have any real cleaning properties in there. Best application for this product is for a car that has been sitting in a shed/garage and just been collecting dust. As soon as a car has been driven out it collects other atmospheric impurities which mostly are microscopic and thus this process is not ideal as you don’t want the duster collecting this.
- Presently all waterless wash & polish products on the market require 2 microfibre/terry towels. However the problem with dry towels is that they drag what ever they pick up. So they are great for removing polish because the surface is clean but when removing dirt they will pick up and drag into the next area you wipe in. Even if you continuously turn the cloth/towel they are too abrasive for your cars paint work.
- To summarise this section is that the Meguiars process is unique and good for cars that just have dust but not for cars that have been driven on the roads. However every other product that suggests they clean and polish/wax a surface by using a Microfibre towel without scratching is a lie. If you don’t believe conduct this little test for yourself: use the waterless product, then after you have finished, collect a clean microfiber towel and some Wax & Grease Remove i.e K & H or Motospray, apply a good amount to the towel and wipe it on a panel of the car back and forth a few times and then turn the towel to a clean side and wipe it dry. I bet you will see more scratches and marks that weren’t there before, why… because the Wax & Grease remover, took away the fillers and polish/wax from the surface and should it for what it truly looks like. Now you may not think this to be a problem, so what if the waterless wash & polish scratches with every clean, as long as I cant see it, then who cares, right? Wrong… if you don’t use the product for the next clean or just wait more than a couple of weeks before your next clean, the polish/wax and fillers will fall out and the paint protection that was claimed by the product wont exist.
StyleMagic Water Wise Car Wash product
- The Style Magic Water Wise Car Wash stands out from the crowd again, the main differences being it is completely, natural doesn’t contain any polishes/wax so what you see is what you get and it is used with a damp chamois instead of a micofibre towel. And to put it quite simply its a very good natural, non-abrasive lubricant, nothing more, nothing less.
- It is made from botanical ingredients, therefore its completely natural and you can drink it.
- it doesnt have any polishes or waxes in it, so if your car’s paint work is oxidised, dull and dirty, then after you have cleaned it with Style Magic it will still look oxidised and dull but it will be clean.
- its pH Neutral so it doesnt break down your favourite polish, wax or sealant.
- it is made from distilled (99% pure water) so all possible chemicals that are in water we drink is removed. And so if overspray of the product is left on the painted surface it will dry without any water spots.
- unlike waterless washes & polish/waxes on the market it is used with a damp synthetic perforated chamois, not a microfibre towel. Where a clean side of the chamois is always used and the chamois is constantly cleaned during the washing process, so you never wiping dirt into the panel. It requires no pressure and therefore NO pressure should be used when cleaning the surface.
- It is really designed for cars that are city driven where not much dust and dirt can collect onto the painted surface. For the enthusiast he/she should be cleaning the regular driven car once/twice a week so the product and process is perfect for that, any longer and you run the risk of creating light marks into the paintwork.
However I think the biggest difference that I have noticed when correcting marks made by the StyleMagic process vs washing with sponge, wash & water (after 3 months of cleaning) is that the StyleMagic marks can be filled in and completely hidden without the removal of paint whereas 90% of the time the marks are deeper and more concentrated from the sponge, wash & water process, so the paint needs to be cut a little bit for full correction to occur. The beauty with using some of the filling products like Glare, Driven, Toughseal is that they last for a long time, more than 6 months and the StyleMagic doesn’t break down the polish or remove the fillers.
Cheers, and enjoy the cleaning!!
About Joe
He works for the Adelaide car grooming company Glowridaz. They are based in Lonsdale, and you can view the site at www.glowridaz.com.au
Be especially sure to check out the work shops he runs if you are really keen to learn something (http://www.glowridaz.com.au/training.html).
Some people on SAR have used his services and have learnt heaps!!
Onto the guide:
Paint Work
- Modern day car paints today use a Clear coat finishes (also referred to as two-stage paint systems) are simply a layer of clear resin applied over the top of colored resin. Although a clear coat does protect the base coat, just like a single-stage finish, the clear coat needs to be regularly maintained to keep it in top shape.
- Paint needs to flex because if it didnt when you go for a drive or if someone put pressure on a panel, the paint would crack and fall off.
- Because paint needs to flex it is therefore very delicate and its abrasion resistance is very low and a rub or touch with the slightest amount of dirt or dust & pressure will cause a scratch.
Scratches
- There are different levels of scratches that can occur on your paint work, chrome, plastics, metal, mouldings etc.
- There are swirl marks or spider webbing which come from general cleaning of the car where by people in general apply too much pressure with a sponge or high pressure hose and they are created.
- There are 1500, 1200, 600 grit scratches which are deeper and they come from a number of scenarios. Most common one that I see is people get a bird dropping on their car which they leave. The sun and the acids/chemicals in the bird dropping edge into the paint work and leave a lovely mark which appears to be on the surface. People then go "Oh buggar" and try to scrub away this mark, at this stage they are applying huge amounts of pressure with a sponge or whatever scrubbing tool they can find and then realise after their attempt, the mark appears to be gone but the edging has been replaced with a number of scratches back and forth over the area that they tried to remove. Please dont do this.
- Bird, water spot edging into paint work that is unprotected most of the time cannot be removed unless some of or at times all the clear coat is removed from. The reason for this is that the acid from these contaminants with the aid of the sun has gone right through the clear coat and into the base coat.
Water
- it is not a lubricant, therefore it doesn't break up dirt, dust, or contaminants on your car.
- it contains minerals/chemicals which allow us to drink it without getting sick from germs
- when water mixes with oxygen (thus is left to dry) in crevasses, cracks, wiring or other components of the car it starts to rust or break down plastics.
- water from a car wash (which use recycle water) use even stronger chemicals to break down containments/oils/chemicals found in recycled water.
- non pure water i.e. that from the tap or from rain, that is left on the car to dry in the hot sun will cause water spot edging and stains. If the surface is not protected then some of the clear coat needs to be removed in order to remove the stain.
- distilled water (99% pure water) can be left on your car to dry without causing any damage to the paint work as it doesn’t contain any chemicals its purely H20.
Car Wash process with water, sponge, car wash detergent
- I find this topic pretty amusing because I find the process of cleaning a car with a sponge/wash mitt to be counter intuitive. The process requires you to use pressure to apply the sponge to the car’s panel to the rid the car of any further contaminants or dirt; however it’s that very pressure mixed with a slightly dirty surface which causes the damage to the car.
- In saying this you can of course clean a car with a sponge and car wash detergent without creating any damage but it requires the following conditions:
- The car needs to be washed under cover, in the shade and out of the sun.
- Firstly pre soaking the car’s surface with car wash detergent on low pressure & letting that sit on for a few minutes.
- Secondly rinsing this off with a higher pressure gun and not aiming the hose directly into the panel and standing at least a few metres away from the panel.
- Thirdly 2 buckets of water are required, one with the car wash mix and the other of clean water.
- The sponge/wash mitt used needs to be extremely clean and soft so that any pressure onto the car won’t create any damage.
- Sponge the car down, working top to bottom and after every panel rinse the sponge/wash mitt into the clean bucket of water first before re-sudding the sponge/wash mitt into the second bucket.
- After sponging the car down, rinse the remaining suds off with a pressure gun, if possible distilled water is the best to be used.
- Use a chamois or waffle weave drying towel to remove the excess water from the surface.
- If possible go for a short drive so the excess water in cracks and crevasses can drip out.
- Dry up any excess water from the drive.
Correctly washing the car with sponge and wash detergent is not a quick and easy process it takes time and concentration on the areas that you are cleaning to ensure no damage is caused. However if done correctly almost no scratching should occur. Now it might seem I am against cleaining a car with a sponge and car wash detergent process, well the truth is Im not, I actually believe its just about the best way to clean your car. However the part gets me fired up is that when the above steps and care arent taken place and the scratches are created and then owner of the car brings it in to get repaired and wonder why it costs as much as it does.
- So if the surface is dirty and you use a sponge, water and detergent doesn’t lift the dirt off the surface; instead dirt particles are grounded into the paint. That is why over time, you see on the paint work of your car, marks (scratches) in a swirl motion.
- Commercial carwash brushes can be even more abrasive. The reason they are is that over time the fibres of the brush deteriorate in quality and gather tiny rocks or particles which further scratch your paint!
- I have a friend who scratched his car at the local car wash with a car brush, so he went to the owner of the place and said are you going to reimburse me, and they said no. Because if they reimbursed him, they would have to reimburse everyone that would complain.
- the best way to get the majority of dirt and grime off you car is by using a low pressure hose with pure water either distilled or demineralised. Too much pressure will force dirt into the paint work, which is the same as using your hand pushing on the panel.
Understanding Waterless car washes and polishes/waxes
- there are over 20+ brands of these types of products on the market that I am aware of and that I have tried and they are all variations on the same theme.
- there are 2 main categories as to which these products try to achieve a clean shiny finish.
- Polyglaze, Turtle Wax, are the cheaper products on the market. They contain strong chemicals in particular solvent based silicones which are a big no no, that help break up dust/dirt and give a shiny finish, but in essence they are cheap product that meets the requirements of the shops shelves, i.e. price. No true car enthusiast will use products like this.
- there are more expensive ones out there i.e. Dri Wash N Guard, AutoShine, NoWet etc etc which contain good lubricants mixed with some abrasives i.e. pumas, which in essence remove dirt/dust/containments and some petroleum or alcohol mixed with caranuaba wax or polish & some filling agents which will fill in any marks/scratches created and provide a shiny finish. Unfortunately the abrasive component of these product, removes a little bit of your clear coat every time.... mmmm not very good at all. Its like using a very light cutting polish every time to clean your car. Any product that can remove oxidisation is not a car wash product but a polishing product with cutting ability.
- The Meguiars Waterless Process stands out from these products by using a 2 step process which I personally think is much better. Firstly they advise its not for real dirty cars which is fantastic and truthful, not like its competitors. The first step in the Meguiars process is to clear as much dust off the surface with a quality duster containing paraffin oil, which works pretty good I must say. Then its finished with their Waterless Wash and applied with a Microfibre towel. The Waterless wash is essentially a propylene glycol mix with mostly water which will give a shiny finish, it doesn’t have any real cleaning properties in there. Best application for this product is for a car that has been sitting in a shed/garage and just been collecting dust. As soon as a car has been driven out it collects other atmospheric impurities which mostly are microscopic and thus this process is not ideal as you don’t want the duster collecting this.
- Presently all waterless wash & polish products on the market require 2 microfibre/terry towels. However the problem with dry towels is that they drag what ever they pick up. So they are great for removing polish because the surface is clean but when removing dirt they will pick up and drag into the next area you wipe in. Even if you continuously turn the cloth/towel they are too abrasive for your cars paint work.
- To summarise this section is that the Meguiars process is unique and good for cars that just have dust but not for cars that have been driven on the roads. However every other product that suggests they clean and polish/wax a surface by using a Microfibre towel without scratching is a lie. If you don’t believe conduct this little test for yourself: use the waterless product, then after you have finished, collect a clean microfiber towel and some Wax & Grease Remove i.e K & H or Motospray, apply a good amount to the towel and wipe it on a panel of the car back and forth a few times and then turn the towel to a clean side and wipe it dry. I bet you will see more scratches and marks that weren’t there before, why… because the Wax & Grease remover, took away the fillers and polish/wax from the surface and should it for what it truly looks like. Now you may not think this to be a problem, so what if the waterless wash & polish scratches with every clean, as long as I cant see it, then who cares, right? Wrong… if you don’t use the product for the next clean or just wait more than a couple of weeks before your next clean, the polish/wax and fillers will fall out and the paint protection that was claimed by the product wont exist.
StyleMagic Water Wise Car Wash product
- The Style Magic Water Wise Car Wash stands out from the crowd again, the main differences being it is completely, natural doesn’t contain any polishes/wax so what you see is what you get and it is used with a damp chamois instead of a micofibre towel. And to put it quite simply its a very good natural, non-abrasive lubricant, nothing more, nothing less.
- It is made from botanical ingredients, therefore its completely natural and you can drink it.
- it doesnt have any polishes or waxes in it, so if your car’s paint work is oxidised, dull and dirty, then after you have cleaned it with Style Magic it will still look oxidised and dull but it will be clean.
- its pH Neutral so it doesnt break down your favourite polish, wax or sealant.
- it is made from distilled (99% pure water) so all possible chemicals that are in water we drink is removed. And so if overspray of the product is left on the painted surface it will dry without any water spots.
- unlike waterless washes & polish/waxes on the market it is used with a damp synthetic perforated chamois, not a microfibre towel. Where a clean side of the chamois is always used and the chamois is constantly cleaned during the washing process, so you never wiping dirt into the panel. It requires no pressure and therefore NO pressure should be used when cleaning the surface.
- It is really designed for cars that are city driven where not much dust and dirt can collect onto the painted surface. For the enthusiast he/she should be cleaning the regular driven car once/twice a week so the product and process is perfect for that, any longer and you run the risk of creating light marks into the paintwork.
However I think the biggest difference that I have noticed when correcting marks made by the StyleMagic process vs washing with sponge, wash & water (after 3 months of cleaning) is that the StyleMagic marks can be filled in and completely hidden without the removal of paint whereas 90% of the time the marks are deeper and more concentrated from the sponge, wash & water process, so the paint needs to be cut a little bit for full correction to occur. The beauty with using some of the filling products like Glare, Driven, Toughseal is that they last for a long time, more than 6 months and the StyleMagic doesn’t break down the polish or remove the fillers.
Cheers, and enjoy the cleaning!!